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"Systemic issues with urgent care"

About: Forth Valley Royal Hospital / Accident & emergency General practices in Forth Valley NHS 24 / NHS 24 (111 service)

(as a parent/guardian),

My 15-week-old son developed a rash on his face very quickly around 2pm. I called my GP surgery at 2.30pm, who told me they didn't have any appointments and to either attend A&E or wait until 6pm and contact 111. I explained that I didn't want to expose my son to the risks of A&E as he is still so young and only had two sets of his vaccinations but that I wasn't comfortable waiting until 6pm to seek attention. I was told these were my only options. I asked if I should go to see a pharmacist but was told they wouldn't see a baby. This left me feeling unsupported and helpless. I wasn't sure what was going to be more harmful to my baby. 

I contacted my health visitor who was extremely helpful and thorough. She talked through various symptoms with me and left me feeling more confident. I decided to keep a close eye on my son, contact 111 at 6pm unless anything worsened. 

Around 4pm, the rash seemed to be spreading and my son had diarrhoea more than once. I contacted my GP again to explain things have worsened, I really don't want to have to go to A&E with my baby when this wasn't an accident or an emergency but did require urgent attention. I was told categorically no one would have any time to see my son and to go to A&E if I wanted him seen. 

I went to A&E. We were booked in at 4.40pm. The waiting room was extremely busy, I was anxious immediately regarding his exposure to unwell people but felt I had no choice. 

Shortly after 6pm I tried 111 to see if this avenue would allow us to be seen quicker. As there is no service in the hospital building, once I'd requested a ring back I had to continually go in and out of the building, so I could comfort my son but also try to ensure I didn't miss the call back. I missed the call backs whilst inside breastfeeding my son. 

At around 8pm my son was very upset and difficult to settle. I approached triage again who very helpful and took his vital signs again. At this point, they advised me that I am probably best to contact 111. Waiting time increase from 5.5 hours when we first arrived to 10 hours and I was told it was likely to be even longer. 

From 8.30pm I stood outside the hospital in 1 degree Celsius to call 111 and speak with someone who could potentially arrange for my son to be seen quicker despite having been in an A&E department for 4 hours. I was outside, away from my unwell, breastfed baby from 8.30pm until 11pm as the weather got colder and darker. Additionally, I have Raynaud's phenomenon/vasospasm in my nipples so the entire time I was outside by nipples and breasts were extremely painful. When I did speak with a medical professional on 111, I was told to stay at A&E. This was extremely frustrating. We continued to wait at A&E and were eventually seen by a doctor shortly after midnight. 

All staff we encountered were caring, understanding and apologetic regarding the situation we were in. 

My greatest frustrations were-

1. Even at 2.30pm in the afternoon, when contacting a GP regarding concerning symptoms in a 3 month old baby not a single medical professional in the practice could have seen him that day? Our experience would have been vastly different had someone seen us at our GP practice. 

My son would have been exposed to less risks, his recovery would have been much better had he spent that evening at home rather than in an A&E waiting room, and my own health and wellbeing would have been manageable having lived with an anxiety disorder for 12 years and currently managing Raynaud's.

2. If 111 was going to be more suitable for me, why wasn't I told this when first triaged and not after having waited 4 hours. When I eventually spoke with someone through 111 they said out of hours GP wouldn't handle a rash in a baby that young and would have sent me back to A&E. How is this not known by A&E? I spent 2.5 hours outside in freezing cold weather away from my breastfed, unwell baby to be told to stay where I was. 

I feel that this experience highlights systemic issues within the health care system. The result of an overworked and underfunded NHS. In my view, greater social care and funding is essential to reduce strain on the GP and hospital services. If the GP had greater resources, we should have been seen in a much more effective and appropriate manner. The time from when I first contacted my GP practice to being seen was 10 hours. This isn't urgent care. My son is only 15 weeks and to have to wait that long is extremely disappointing and in some cases, could have devastating consequences. 

This is a systemic problem, which occurred in spite of staff giving excellent care, with little thanks, in a system which from my experience is not fit for purpose. 

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Responses

Response from Caroline Logan, Person Centred Co-ordinator, Nursing, NHS Forth Valley 5 days ago
Caroline Logan
Person Centred Co-ordinator, Nursing,
NHS Forth Valley
Submitted on 31/03/2025 at 11:38
Published on Care Opinion at 11:38


Dear krab93

How upsetting and distressing your experience must have been and thank you for sharing this with me. It is never easy when our wee ones are unwell and we are looking for support and advice and I was pleased to read that you contacted your Health Visitor who was thorough, helpful and supported you.

I know staff will be disappointed to read that you had to wait so long to be seen by an ED Doctor. Unfortunately, our ED is extremely busy and staff ensure that all patients are triaged and seen based on their clinical need but I know that the length of wait would have been distressing for you. I hope following your attendance at ED your son is feeling better.

I will ask a senior member of the ED Team to contact you to discuss your concerns and to enable me to share your story with your GP Practice, who will also contact you separately, I would be grateful if you could provide me with your contact number and which GP Practice you attend. You can contact me on 01324 566162 or by e-mail caroline.logan@nhs.scot.

I hope this is helpful.

Kind regards

Caroline

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Response from Stephanie W, Patient Experience Officer, Nursing and Care, NHS 24 5 days ago
Stephanie W
Patient Experience Officer, Nursing and Care,
NHS 24

Manages patient feedback

Submitted on 31/03/2025 at 12:08
Published on Care Opinion at 12:08


picture of Stephanie W

Dear krab93,

Thank you for sharing your experience on Care Opinion.

I note there are multiple services tagged in your story, I reply on behalf of NHS 24.

I was so sorry to learn you had cause to contact 111 on behalf of your baby son, I can only imagine how worrying this must have been and I do hope your son is now doing well.

During the ‘in hours' period (8am-6pm) patient’s own GP surgeries do indeed have a duty of care to patients. However, it may be helpful to explain, the option to contact NHS 24 on 111 and select the Accident & Emergency line is available 24/7 if you feel it is an emergency, even during the day time when your GP surgery is open.

I read your story with concern and would like the opportunity to review your contact with 111 in more detail. If you would like us to review this matter, or if you have any other feedback relating to your call to the 111 service, could I kindly ask you to contact us at Patient.Experience@nhs24.scot.nhs.uk, including your Care Opinion username and we would be pleased to look into this further.

Thank you again for sharing your experience. I wish you and your son all the best.

Kind regards,

Stephanie

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